Donald Heathfield owned U.S. consulting company, was educated at Harvard and raised wife and two children. He was quite successful American citizen. Hardly anyone of his friends and colleagues could have imagined that Donald Heathfield's real name is Andrey Bezrukov and he is the head of the Russian reconnaissance. Bezrukov worked abroad under cover since the end of last century and during this time did not utter a single word in Russian. Two years ago he was the betrayer, after which he returned to Russia
Let us first clarify what do we call something, what were you doing in the USA. Espionage?
It's the same than the American special services are doing in Russia. You know, there's a difference in definitions. In English "espionage" is translated as spying, but in Russian spy has two meanings: "the spy" and "scout". Can be understood in different ways. Not in vain in the Soviet Union, its called good word "scout" and your enemies — "spies".
They say that for all the time you never said a word in Russian. Is this true?
And your wife worked with you? She too was under the cover?
Yes, my wife Elena is also a professional scout, and we worked abroad together with the first to the last day.
You have lived a long time in the country, actually working against her, so?
You know, intelligence is not defined by those against whom you're working. Intelligence is determined by what you're working for. "Run against someone" — this cannot be a reference point, objectives can change. As a scout you work to benefit their country. Crime may be against someone, and reconnaissance as an activity is in the nature of Patriotic.
And how then you perceive people around, if not as enemies?
As the main object of study. This is the country you should know that the people you want to understand to help guide their country to make the right decisions.
We have the scout — this is what-something like the scientist under the guise of?
Yes, very often raises issues of cognition, comprehension questions. I would even say so: in order to win, you need to understand in order to understand, we must love. So you have to love the country in which we operate. The presence of a person contrary to misinformation on the site to understand what is happening, is a positive stabilizing factor. In order to prepare to defend themselves, sometimes enough nuggets of critical information. I would say that intelligence is inherently defensive exercise.
You were able to love US?
I will not say that this country I love. Culturally, I lived in the more interesting countries than the United States. But I certainly respect the Americans. I like many American people, such as optimism, ingenuity, readiness for change, the ability to quickly and honestly admit and correct their mistakes.
Where you more like to live: after an exchange in Russia or in the USA?
Frankly, I'm more interested now to live in Russia. First, it is my culture. But most importantly, in Russia, I witnessed the historical moment — the process of formation of a new country. This process is difficult, painful, but extremely interesting, especially for me, whose job was to understand what is really happening and what forces are behind this.
You can clarify? You worked in USA from 1999 year, and up to this?
I can't comment on it.
What business have you been in America?
I am an expert in strategic forecasting, for shaping the future. My scientific articles and patents relate generally to this area. I worked with leading corporations and governmental bodies of several countries, including the United States. But as a consultant I had to work in other areas: change management in corporations, to organize the struggle for big contracts and so forth.
Money, business, who need to, — it's the same a whole life for the border...
Yes, of course. In General, if you look from a professional point of view, when a person in my situation is abroad, he should totally build a new life and in material terms and in terms of the family. In fact, he begins life anew. You can say, feel like a different person. My wife and I flew on a business trip with one suitcase. Had to re get educated, find a job, create a business, and not one. Without any help and with minimal means — do you remember what the situation was in our country at that time. And while doing our main task — to perform tasks.
How you got to Harvard University?
At Harvard I received a master's degree in public administration. When you receive a detailed selection procedure as other candidates, including tests, motivation letter, recommendation. I already had a diploma and MBA, and a diploma in world economy and the experience of creating and conducting business. That is, the degree of preparation I from other candidates was no different.
Scout need acting talent?
Yes, I think so.
And choose never not going to become an actor?
No. Just if the actor is reincarnated at a certain time, and then comes back into your life, then there is a gradual transformation, but a deeper, comprehensive. You really become a person of another nation, another language, but not other ideas.
Happened, that the psychological fatigue, if she was, reached a critical level, so, what are youready were all to quit?
No, never happened, because I loved his work. I feel very happy. I was in the shower and stay romantic. Intelligence is the most romantic profession. My colleagues and colleagues — those that I know personally and about whom she had heard, the people are wonderful, talented, extraordinary, often humanly difficult. These are people of remarkable purity. About their lives, often difficult in personal terms, you can write books. And that's sad and tragic, the best of them, we often find out only after their death, if at all ever... You know, work illegally cleanses people of their communion something higher — the vanity of time.
What qualities are important for a scout? What is the main?
I think that patriotism. In this and only this the whole point of the work. Money cannot be the meaning of intelligence. Only a devotee of the ideas people can do their own thing, knowing that the rest of your life to spend in prison. Any material benefits not to justify.
Job scout like in the movies about James bond? What it is: routine or all the same a real risk?
I will say this: razvedrota is not built for it failed. That is, the risk is clear, and decisions are made so that this risk is minimized. Intelligence is not an adventurous adventure. If you behave like a bond, you will have enough for half a day, maximum one day. Even if we imagine that there is a magical box, in which lie all the secrets, tomorrow half of them will become obsolete and will be unnecessary. The highest class of intelligence is to understand what your opponent is going to think tomorrow, instead of what he was thinking yesterday.
What means for you the word "patriotism"?
I think patriotism is understanding your place in the world as part of Russia. These are my friends, my parents, my lineage, which goes back in the days of Yermak, when my prepreparatory came to Siberia. For me to forget it — so left with nothing. I as a historian in the Russian education is especially close to the idea of the great and tragic history of my country, those fractures through which she passed, her endless, painful search for itself between East and West.
Turns out, that this national spark is in each. But not is whether it is just merely a condiment to the cold political struggle?
No. Let's talk about the national idea, not even touching the political struggle. The national idea is an understanding of what place in the world is your country, that we as a nation want, what can prevent and what can't. If we have a common understanding of who we are, where we go, what are the principles laid in the Foundation, is what unites people, what is called national idea. The ideas that were unifying for us before, more are not. They are gone. Russia is now in the process of formation of new ideas. The political struggle around that, how do you see the future of Russia, is a Testament of the ongoing process of crystallization of the national idea, the element of creation.
How would you characterize the present period in the history of Russia?
I think we are at a very interesting stage, when we are involved in the formation of a new country. This painful period through which many countries were held. Most importantly — to ourselves not to spoil it. Not to destabilize the country and to find common ground and decide in which direction to develop. We have no consensus, but as a nation we should give such a reply not to turn the boat in which they all sit.
Your children are now 18 and 22 years. They were born at the border, right?
Yes, our children were born and raised abroad. Grew there like normal children, of course, not knowing a word of Russian.
They lived there entire life. Perhaps, in them more American?
That before coming to Russia, there was nothing Russian that is a fact, but a typical Americans, I would also not called. Knowing how American cultural cauldron melts all on a single sample, we deliberately selected the children to a French school. To maintain the European, outdoor, wide view on life is simplistic cliches and empty political correctness. And, of course, tried to have as many opportunities as possible to see and compare the different countries, to draw conclusions. Obviously, living in another country, it is impossible to join Russian values. But you can instill if not a love, because they do not know the country, at least respect.
As children experienced it, what happened with you, in particular the arrest?
We were arrested during the celebration of the birthday of our eldest son. A few minutes the children thought it was just a prank — a crowd of people in dark suits in black cars... of Course, for them it was a shock. But out of this shock helps that as parents we are constantly kept with them a good mental contact, and open dialogue in the family, understanding and trust. After our arrest, they flew to Russia at our request, not knowing who they meet and what is waiting for them... When, after exchanging we finally met them in Russia and they learned the truth about our profession, the first month we spent all night talking about life and history. I think in the end they had the understanding, why we made certain choices in life. Despite all the difficulties of adaptation in adulthood, in Russia they have something that had never happened, grandparents, family with its long history, which loves them.
As suggested if you have them whatisthe ideology?
No, we were just trying to raise them with decent, honest people, open to new ideas, open to the world. So they were humanists by and large.
As now formed their fate? Turned from them to integrate into Russian society?
They are in the process of integration, which is now very difficult. Russian language, of course, is not the easiest to learn. Them two years was able to travel around the country, and the strongest impression they were particularly impressed with the nature, especially Siberia. The sons of their plans that have nothing to do with politics or intelligence. The senior is more interested in the business, especially the financial sector.
Your group uncovered after the fact, like you betrayed one of officers of service of external intelligence. What would you he said, if you 'd met?
Well, I think he's in any case, this type of the Pot, tried not to meet with me...
And suddenly? Just to introduce myself.
You know, I wouldn't tell him anything. There is no need. In my opinion, it the rest of your life and it will be pretty bad. Treason, like the plague: if it is present within you, it will eat you. It is impossible to maintain some emotional balance in your life when you realize that someone has betrayed or killed. And his father was a Hero of the Soviet Union. He betrayed not only himself — he killed the memory of their parents. Whatever money he paid, I agree with Vladimir Putin, who said that his life is difficult to envy. He will either drink, or just eat longing: to Wake up every morning and remember that you did. You know, the CIA and FBI treachery Poteeva very happy, but to the traitors attitude, like everywhere, disgusting. After two years in the U.S., he probably is already felt. He was already tired. He don't need them anymore. Like a squeezed lemon.
What if it were the motives?
I think this is the person for whom the homeland and intelligence were minor things, and therefore a bargaining chip. Add to this unsatisfied ambition and a taste for money, and he was ready to sacrifice principles for a price.
Faced if you with scouts, which have been overbought or turned?
No, never encountered. Not heard about any this professional, and even less about the illegal alien who could be better to switch. My impression of the pot was the traitor that he is weak as a professional. In the intelligence was a random person, and here's the result.
When you opened, tried if outbid, to recruit?
No. And the traitor Poteev, and from my own observations they knew that it was useless. Me and wife FBI agents were after the arrest as professionals to professionals — stressed respectful.
You can do a little more about that, what happened after that, as you revealed? What you felt in that moment?
Immediately after the arrest I remember a state of complete internal mobilization, even purely physical. As if all the old life, all the plans suddenly went on the back burner, at some fog. The main thing was the desire to understand the cause of the failure and find a way to contact his wife and children. It was the understanding that the old life is over and begins another stage — the stage of struggle under the new rules, which could last for many years. It is a state of complete readiness every minute to everything brand continued for ten days until it became clear that at the highest level, negotiations about our liberation.
As you, the expert, the historian, who knows the country people see America?
The United States are experiencing a rather difficult period, when the superpower becomes a normal strong country. Maybe a leader in certain areas, but not unconditional. In the States it is perceived quite painfully. There are people who ask the question, what place the U.S. will occupy in the world. Interestingly, many of these people — military intellectuals, highly educated layer who can really assess the situation of the country. These military offer USA to take a position that focuses more on cooperation in solving global problems is not only the country but also the world, such as the slowdown in economic growth, instead of supporting its position by force anywhere. But they are still in the minority. This dialogue about the future of America is just beginning, but we need to monitor it, as it affects Russia, as they see us as the enemy or, more realistically, as one of the strong players in a multipolar world.
How Americans perceive Russia?
Generally in the American media and American politicians Russia occupies a marginal position. After the USSR disappeared, they really only care about the topic of our military potential, which is still a danger. I don't think American politicians are interested in some other aspect. It all comes down to clichés: Russia is imperfect, not playing by the rules is undemocratic. Russia seems so weak and uninteresting, not worthy of a real partnership dialogue. It's like in relations between people: to respect others we must first respect themselves.
You were born in one country, worked in the one that competed with the first, and came back in the third...
What I left the country, which was called the Soviet Union, and returned to the one that is called Russia, did to me not affected. For me it's one country. My country.
Talked Innocent Peshkov
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